Thor Industries buys controlling interest in Heartland RVs, LLC

Re: Thor quality and service

I'm not concerned. It's not like this news will turn my existing 2010 into an instant pumpkin. If a larger, better funded company can add value to Heartland, great. As with all things, change is inevitable.

Re: Thor quality and service

Just looking for some upsides here since lots of people, including me, have stated the concerns.

1. I looked at Thor's Annual Report and they say their strategy is to operate their business units operate on a decentralized basis (its available on their web site as they are a public company). The proof will be in the pudding on this one.
2. Thor's balance sheet is also very strong with lots of cash/working capital and even in 2009 they were profitable. This financial strength should bode well for future investments in their products.
3. Perhaps the additional size/volume will give them additional clout over suppliers like Lippert. Or Thor/Heartland will obtain the size to manufacture their own frames or suspension and hopefully improve quality. The bigger they are, the more strategic options become available to them.

Re: Thor quality and service

Got to thinking about this awhile. We are on our 3rd Bighorn dealer in this area in 4 years. The warranty is only as good as the dealer. The present dealer wanted to take pictures and email to get permission to change a two bit cable end that took me 2 minutes to do myself. So much for dealer warranty. Things just might shape up on the dealer end now. You just never know.

I don't necissarliy believe that this spells the end of Heartland, but it does spell the end as we know it. That's the only real for sure bummer here.

Anyone who truely believes that any parent company opperates strictly hands off is either fooling themselves or has no expeience in the matter. I've never seen that happen with any company purchase of this size. No body spends $200 million and doesn't get involved in it at some level. What level is admittedly yet to be seen, but I'm slightly insulted to be led to believe otherwise.

While it can be true that this allows Heartland buying power, by extension, and more true to my expeience at least, is that Thor now has income from a winning company to carry along it's other suffering brands. Let's be realistic here, Keystone and many other Thor's manufactures suffered greatly over the past couple years while Heartland grew. Since it's sucessfull, the income and personel from Heartland will likely be bled off to feed other still struggling (or failing) sister companies. Good for Thor naturally, bad for Heartland. Why do we even suggest Heartland needed Thor for cash flow? What institution these days wouldn't lend to a comapny that grew 15+% while so many other were tanking?

Jim, I'm gald that your position is safe for a while. I think the overhead relative to the benifit it provides to Heartland owners and potential owners is easily justified. I remain hopefull that Thor's bean counters will realize that too. However, have any of you been to Keystone's owners page? Don't bother.

Re: Thor quality and service

Based on my experience of aqusitions and growing from a small family business to a multy million $ operation. When the BIG investers say we need 2 more points on your bottom line...you find it. They probably will not say cheapen the product, they just say we need more profit. some companies can deliver this without cutting CS and quality, others......

I left the corporate world because of this very thing. We were told things like 1, not in the forseeable future 2. No plans to do this or that. They didn't do any of those things, we just had to produce more profit. We started ( it was my job as VP of HR and Labour Relations) to get rid of the higher priced help and replace them with cheaper labour. I was forced to remove long time employees who were very good at their work for sake of the bottom line.

Time will tell and I truly hope that 2 or 3 years from you all can tell me I had no idea what I was talking about. Have a look at where General coach from Oliver BC went?

That is the last I will say on the matter, I still have warranty and will not let anything go un fixed before the warranty runs out.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

Hi--I think I will weigh in on this---As long as Jim B, Jim Fenner and Matt Cameron stay ( of coarse with a raise involved ) I am happy camper(pun intended).

President Brady has fought hard for us and he will continue to do so.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

We love our Big Country and plan on enjoying it for many years to come!

I'm sure there will be some changes with this, but.....in the overall scheme of things......they probably won't be eternally significant. Life is short and full of bumps......don't let the bumps worry you so much that you forget to enjoy the journey.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

Over the years we have owned Prowler, Chateau, Terry, Wilderness, Wildcat, Starcraft and Shasta.

I love my Bighorn and nothing is going to change that. We didn't make our purchase because of a specific manufacturer. We made it because we loved what we saw. Our pleasure comes from the memories of the places we have been, the fun we have had and the precious friendships we have made along the way! The Forum and the Owners Club has made the difference for me.

Life is WHAT WE MAKE IT, not WHO MADE IT!

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

I found out about the acquisition at a RV show today from a dealer... I and he had not read any forum post on the matter so I was not influenced by the forum and I formed my own opinion. I've been around campers, RV's and Motorcoach owners and units for about 4 decades... a long time. I was always impressed with THOR products, more importantly, so were THOR owners.

I also remember when THOR bought Damon, I remember reading THOR's M.O. They use a hands off approach, if it ain't broke they don't fix it. I don't think HeartLand is broke, so THOR probably won't fix it. Probably the only thing that will change is the bank where profits are deposited, I don't care about that. Another plus is, when I buy my next BigHorn and I will, I know Heartland will still be in business because THOR bought them. THOR is a bigger company then HeartLand and bigger is better in this economic climate. Another positive is, THOR didn't get so big by being stupid, they would not have thrown good money after bad and bought a looser, that's a big indicator HeartLand is a winner and will remain one. I thought the purchase to be a feather in HeartLand's cap a compliment.

Finally, most people don't like change and it brings out emotions. However, in fairness I'm going to give HeartLand and THOR the time they need to win back everyone who didn't like the acquisition. I mean let's think about it, if THOR was/is this big mean company the first thing they will or should do is shut down this complaining forum quickly, after all it is their right to do so... I'm betting on us all typing away for years to come on this forum. If I'm wrong at least no one will lambast me for being so... no forum, no roasting I'm going to give them both the chance they earned.

In closing :



Tom

Re: Thor thread deleted

I've been reading all the postings. Only time will tell whether this is a good thing or a bad thing. I spent 27 years in the manufacturing world and the only thing that is constant in thie business sector is change. All companies are going to make a profit regardless of what is required. I know because I lost my job at 50 years old in a move to increase profits by the year end. No one really cared because it accomplished what they hoped it would. We may not like the change but this doesn't matter in the business world. I will have to say that in most acquisitions, if a company is making good returns changes will probably not be made. A large company does not purchase a profitable company and try to break it up. Their making this purchase to increase their profits. We also bought our Sundance because we liked waht we saw. I would be more concerned if a large investment company had made a total takeover. In these cases the buyer will break up the company selling the profitable bits for a quick profit and shutting down the non-profitable. I personaaly will take a wait and see before I make my final judgement.

Re: Thor thread deleted

Lets face it, if I was a company like Thor and was able to buy a profitable growing company like Heartland its a no brainer. The least expensive way to grow your business is to purchase upstart companies such as Heartland. Changes, if they are like Warren Buffet they will leave it alone and allow it to keep operating as is!

Re: Thor quality and service

Bob, I agree with you...to a degree ! But I think you'll agree because you have experience as a seasoned owner. You and I see, at least with THOR's Airstream Line, there is an amost cult like following, sorta like groupies. I've seen folks who are quite wealthy, who could afford any RV spend hunders of thousands of dollars to buy a silver bullet TT ! I can't explain it and neither can anyone else, but they do it ? Last year I camped next to a full timer who had more $ in his silver bullet then 2 of my BH's, he didn't even have 1 slide out ??? just can't explain it... The whole time THOR just lurks in the background, taking in profits. Then again, isn't that what any succesful business does ? Isn't that why they are in business ? If they will support and elevate HeartLand products then we all win... isn't that a good thing ? Tom

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

dbylinski said:

Over the years we have owned Prowler, Chateau, Terry, Wilderness, Wildcat, Starcraft and Shasta.

I love my Bighorn and nothing is going to change that. We didn't make our purchase because of a specific manufacturer. We made it because we loved what we saw. Our pleasure comes from the memories of the places we have been, the fun we have had and the precious friendships we have made along the way! The Forum and the Owners Club has made the difference for me.

Life is WHAT WE MAKE IT, not WHO MADE IT!

Click to expand...

Well said Deb! I agree 100%!

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

You hit the nail on the head Deb! Let's not over-react. I'm expecting everything to continue to go on as always, with Jim B. doing a fantastic job with the Forum and Owner's Club and us having great trips with our many wonderful friends.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

If you were a "Maverick" when you bought a Heartland product, you can be a maverick when you buy your next product. I thought I got a great deal with a BH instead of a Cardinal or a Montana. Only time will tell.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

I don't see any difference here that will impact me. I have a Landmark and my wife & I have already decided that any brand loyalty has disappeared and we will purchase our next unit solely on how the unit appears to be built. When we bought the unit we loved it and my wife loved it longer than I did. For me there have been too many major issues and it has been a money pit. My wife has just recently agreed with me because of the maintenance cost but she still loves the layout and features of the unit. So who owns Heartland doesn't matter. I never felt that I could rely on support from Heartland and so when we buy our next unit it will be based on research and past experience as to what I buy.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

I was shocked when Ken told me that Thor had bought Heartland. We were thinking about getting a GS but we will wait to see what happens. We will be waiting to see how the economy does. His and my work is what is keeping us from buying right now but we will see how HL does with Thor as their parent company. I love our trailer and the great people that go to the rallies. Can't wait until next year when we can go again.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

I am less than pleased by this acquisition. If Heartland continues to concentrate on customers needs and innovation, it will be fine. If, in this economy, Thor is looking for quick profit, this will be very harmful if not deadly. I only hope that Thor leaves Heartland the ability to do what has made them as good as they are.

Re: Thor Acquires Heartland RV Stake for $200M

I have to say while I'm not a fan of Thor I am a fan of Heartland, we purchased our Sundance because of quality, good looks, and value. I also have to say hats off to our Heartland leaders that had the insight to start out with an idea for a better product and built such a product. I think it speaks volumes about a product when a larger company is so impressed or worried about the competition that a buy out occurs. Congratulations Heartland for becoming one of those such companies. It doesn't change that much for us, we are STILL a part of the HEARTLAND family and will be a long as we own a Heartland product (which for me will be a long time).

Re: Thor thread deleted

We love our Big Country but cannot use it in hot weather. Maybe a Thor dealer can fix it. So far 2 heartland dealers don't care. Also maybe a Thor dealer can address the "bubbling" on the roof. As you can see I am not a fan of Heartland dealers service. Warranty? What warranty.