Upgraded Brakes Option

[donr827]

We are in the process of tying up the loose ends on our order for the 3055RL floor plan. One off sheet option that is available is an upgrade to heavy duty larger brake pads. The option is expensive, retail $1163, but is it worth the cost. The question that have are most owners happy with the performance of their standard brakes?
Don

 

[Ray LeTourneau]

I'm OK with the performance of my stock 2" shoes but I'm also pretty diligent about regular adjustment and cleaning. Some owners have done their own upgrade to disc brakes for optimum braking. Some have had Mor-Ryde install the disc system. A bit more money but well worth the expense. I haven't heard any talk about the larger shoes you're referring to.

 

[cookie]

If the brakes you are referring to are the 3-1/2 or 3-1/4, I don't remember the correct size, I have heard that they work very well.
I did a DIY disc brake conversion. About $1900. Love em, no adjusting or brake fade.

Peace
Dave

 

[SouthernNights]

We are in the process of tying up the loose ends on our order for the 3055RL floor plan. One off sheet option that is available is an upgrade to heavy duty larger brake pads. The option is expensive, retail $1163, but is it worth the cost. The question that have are most owners happy with the performance of their standard brakes?
Don

The larger brakes work very well but if it was going to cost $1100 to up grade, I think I would put the money towards disc brakes. Either do it yourself or have Mor Ryde put them on for about $2,500.

 

[TeJay]

Breaks work because of the surface area between shoes or pads and the drum or rotor. Wider shoes and drums will imrpove the breaking ability. I would ditto what southernNights said. That's a lot of $$$ for four wider drums and two sets of wider shoes and that's all they have to change. Everything else from your system will work with the new shoes and drums. Remember that the drums and the shoes on it can still be reused. They have little or almost no wear and I know they will put them into their parts room an sell them to another customer. Put your $1100 towards some new discs down the road.

TeJay

 

[dfk009]

I would have to agree with the previous responders, that disc brakes are the only way to go. I would also consider larger axle capacities, with G614 tires to carry 110# air pressure. You can never build a trailer too heavy to carry your load. Don

 

[donr827]

I would have to agree with the previous responders, that disc brakes are the only way to go. I would also consider larger axle capacities, with G614 tires to carry 110# air pressure. You can never build a trailer too heavy to carry your load. Don

We ordered the 7,000 pound axle upgrade.
Don

 

[Bob&Patty]

For the price from HL...your best dollars spent is have them install the Goodyear G-614's. I think its about $600.00 option. Retail they sell for about $240.00 each. I know, I bought a set later on. The 7K axles are a great option. Dual pane windows are worth the money.

 

[donr827]

Appreciate all of the replies. Will give it some more thought and take a peak at the check book.
Don

 

[Firerad1]

We just picked up our 3585RL last month in Elkhart. The larger brakes was a $750.00 option upgrade, but we went with stock axles and brakes. First stop was Mor Ryde and upgraded to 8k IS and Disc Brakes. Two days and $5700.00 later we were ready to head south. We got a great deal working with RV Capital in Elkhart, they let us bring out truck inside their warehouse to unload our belongings into the new Bighorn. Mor Ryde also let us stay in the RV at night when they did the install. Single digets outside, but warm inside. They also lifted the drivers side one inch to level the unit side to side, to compensate for the two large heavier slides on that side. It was matched to my truck for a level ride front to rear also. We plan on extended trips over many years and didn't want to regret not getting IS and disc brakes. I'm very pleased with the our Mor Ryde upgrades.

 

[porthole]

For those considering the disc brake option, I had ours done when new, just sold the old/new complete brake assemblies (4) for $225.
Doesn't sound like much but it knocked the overall brake conversion price down by 10%

 

[porthole]

First stop was Mor Ryde and upgraded to 8k IS and Disc Brakes. T

The good thing about MOR/ryde is that if you determine the 8K is too much (stiff) it is relatively easy to adjust the "spring rate" with a different durometer shear spring. This would be just changing the springs and leaving the hardware intact.

Our Cyclone has the 7K axles springs. After a year of use and inspection at MOR/ryde, the springs were replaced with 8K shears, at no charge.

MOR/ryde service is outstanding, and if you plan on being in the area I would recommend you make an appointment for an inspection. I don't know if the inspections are at no charge but I haven't paid for either of the 2 that have been done.
MOR/ryde option is pricey, but you do get your monies worth.

 

[Willym]

Have to disagree a little. Brakes work based on applied force and friction. The magnets and electric current determine the force, and the shoe material/brake drum determine the friction coefficient. I'm pretty sure that the magnets in the 2" and 3.375" brakes are the same so no greater force is applied. However, there are definite benefits in there being less fade because of lower shoe temperatures, and in there being a lower show wear rate. The latter means that less frequent adjustment is required. As far as I know the wider drums will be auto adjusting which is a plus. However, as others have said, disc brakes are the ultimate in performance improvement.

Breaks work because of the surface area between shoes or pads and the drum or rotor. Wider shoes and drums will imrpove the breaking ability. I would ditto what southernNights said. That's a lot of $$$ for four wider drums and two sets of wider shoes and that's all they have to change. Everything else from your system will work with the new shoes and drums. Remember that the drums and the shoes on it can still be reused. They have little or almost no wear and I know they will put them into their parts room an sell them to another customer. Put your $1100 towards some new discs down the road.

TeJay

 

[porthole]

Electric trailer drum brakes:

Two brake shoes, primary (front) & secondary (rear)
Actuating arm
Cam - pivot
adjusting arm-link-star wheel assembly
magnet
smooth finished interior face drum (hub side)

The magnet is loosely attached to an actuator arm at the bottom of the brake assembly

When you apply current to the magnet, the magnet attempts to attach it self to the drum. If you were looking straight at your wheel from the side, the magnet is moving towards you, 90 degrees in relation to trailer movement.

As current is applied, the magnet moves to the drum face
The rotation of the drum, with the magnet trying to attach itself causes the actuator arm to move.
At the top of the now moving actuator arm there is a cam assembly between the tops of the two brake shoes

Arm is moved by the magnet, cam rotates, the brake shoes start to spread at the top of the drum.

As the shoes start to apply, the front shoe now attempts to rotate with the drum
This movement, through the star adjuster assembly now pushes against the bottom of the rear brake shoe, forcing it even harder into the drum then just the cam action alone.

That is why the front shoe is smaller then the rear shoe, the front shoe is more of an actuator and the rear shoe is the worker.

As current varies to the magnet from your brake controller the "pull" of the magnet varies. The harder the pull, the more the magnet is pulling the actuator arm. The more teh arm moves the more the shoes are applied, the harder the front shoe is pushed into the drum the more it pushes the rear shoe.

Some trailer manufacturers will bias the brake application, e.g. 60% front axle 40% rear axle for the same reason as your vehicle, the front brakes do more of the stopping. This is also a good reason to have your trailer as level as possible when towing. Even if the axles where not biased, a nose high trailer will have slightly less braking with the front axle as compared to the rear axle.

This is also why the average brake controllers work the way they do. Some are a time delay, some are proportional (usually in relation to vehicle movement).

The simple answer with the better proportional controllers is, as voltage is applied and the controller sees a decrease in speed, more current is applied to the trailer brakes. Some controllers use a pendulum to achieve this, which is why the installation instructions will list a maximum out of level mounting position.


There are true proportional controllers available, but few use them, and they can be pricey. Typical is a pressure transducer in the trucks hydraulic brake system. More pressure applied with your foot, more current to the brakes.

The 2011 and above Super Duty's have a true hydraulic activated trailer brake controller, and it works really good.


Wider, larger diameter brakes shoes will apply more force-friction then smaller shoes with a given amount of current, assuming the magnets were the same size.

 

[Willym]

Duane, I agree with you on the larger diameter effect, but I think that the wider drums are the same diameter. The wider shoe does not result in more force being applied however.

 

[TeJay]

My mistake. I failed to add that the two surfaces create the surface area which results in friction once the force is applied. We are converting energy of motion into heat energy. Wider drums and wider shoes create a greater surface area which, even if the applied force is not greater will still create better braking because it creates more heat. Something else not mentioned. Once the heat is generated the larger drums can absorb a greater amount. That factor alone reduces the chance of glazing due to excessive heat build up. We've all stuck needles and nails into a flame. Which heats up faster? The needle because it is smaller and the heat is more concentrated sooner. That's also the reason drums have a maximum size limitation. The more the drum is machined or worn it's diameter/arc becomes larger and the shoes won't mate up as well, which reduces the heat generating effect and the smaller mass of the drum can't absorb as much heat. Disc brakes pads are smaller in surface area compared to shoes but they generate a greater amount of heat because the applied force is greater and all mating surfaces are parallel instead of arced. Discs brakes also cool better/faster because the discs are exposed to the air better than enclosed drums.
TeJay

 

[lwmcguir]

My mistake. I failed to add that the two surfaces create the surface area which results in friction once the force is applied. We are converting energy of motion into heat energy. Wider drums and wider shoes create a greater surface area which, even if the applied force is not greater will still create better braking because it creates more heat. Something else not mentioned. Once the heat is generated the larger drums can absorb a greater amount. That factor alone reduces the chance of glazing due to excessive heat build up. We've all stuck needles and nails into a flame. Which heats up faster? The needle because it is smaller and the heat is more concentrated sooner. That's also the reason drums have a maximum size limitation. The more the drum is machined or worn it's diameter/arc becomes larger and the shoes won't mate up as well, which reduces the heat generating effect and the smaller mass of the drum can't absorb as much heat. Disc brakes pads are smaller in surface area compared to shoes but they generate a greater amount of heat because the applied force is greater and all mating surfaces are parallel instead of arced. Discs brakes also cool better/faster because the discs are exposed to the air better than enclosed drums.
TeJay

We are very happy with the 8k Drum brakes. They can lock the wheels if need be and perform perfectly in Mountain Towing. As you noted, no heating issues when coming down the grades.

 

[TeJay]

pothole,
Sitting here in the camper watching the boats go by I started re-reading some of the posts. I don't know why I didn't read your post about how the magnetic trailer breaks work but I just didn't. Well I read it this morning. That was an excellent post. I've never studied exactly how they work and now I don't have to. Nice job. I'm also still trying to figure out why the manufacturer does not make self adjusting shoe breaks standard on all TT's?? Maybe you have an answer?? It might have something to do with the magnetic and how they work that prevents the addition of a cable or arm that would apply and adjust the shoes when you back up and stop. I'm going to do some net searching for an answer.
Thanks,
TeJay