Ford 6.7L HPFP failures w/o warranty
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mmomega
AnyTimer
Nope, not stating what is right or not right with Ford. I'm not fully aware of each situation on both sides, so I do not know why Ford denied each vehicle. Not that folks are lying but(big but) there are a lot of people that enjoy being the victim so not including all of the facts. We deal with people and insurance and you'd probably be surprised at how many people lie straight to your face to try and swing something in their direction. I'm not saying everyone and I'm not taking up for Ford. Offer me what I want for the price I'm willing to pay and if it makes sense I'll buy it.
This problem is the flavor of the month the internet blows many things out of proportion, there are also plenty of documented cases of Dodge doing the same things if you remember the lift pump + injection pump warranty denials not long ago. Is it right? Again, I do not know the exact reason why warranties were denied.
If a person truly never did anything wrong and a freak fuel pump died and the warranty was canceled then yes that is wrong. Especially when you can prove Fords reason for denial to be false...yes I totally agree with you there. 100%
Also as you know, angry people talk way more than happy folks. I know easily a dozen guys with 6.0's and 6.4's that have had truck problems fixed that some others do not, they are also not on the internet at all to talk about it. Just the way it happens, angry people want to be heard.
I can think of at least 1-2 cases where a fuel pump was replaced and it had not failed completely. I'll try to bookmark them if I find any.
This problem is the flavor of the month the internet blows many things out of proportion, there are also plenty of documented cases of Dodge doing the same things if you remember the lift pump + injection pump warranty denials not long ago. Is it right? Again, I do not know the exact reason why warranties were denied.
If a person truly never did anything wrong and a freak fuel pump died and the warranty was canceled then yes that is wrong. Especially when you can prove Fords reason for denial to be false...yes I totally agree with you there. 100%
Also as you know, angry people talk way more than happy folks. I know easily a dozen guys with 6.0's and 6.4's that have had truck problems fixed that some others do not, they are also not on the internet at all to talk about it. Just the way it happens, angry people want to be heard.
I can think of at least 1-2 cases where a fuel pump was replaced and it had not failed completely. I'll try to bookmark them if I find any.
...a suggestion without explanation...I see no reason to close the thread
There have been over a hundred documented failures of the Ford HPFP...even Ford acknowledges that fact in their NHTSA answers. How many customer pay repairs are unknown but I l know of at least a dozen. The problem, as stated multiple times by Shelby, is the way Ford is handling the repairs. I can unequivocally say that Ford is denying repairs that are clearly a warranty repair. I have the parts and the engineer evaluations to back up that statement. It is also clear that Ford has taken a zero tolerance to HPFP warranty coverage. No dealer will cover a HPFP inder warranty without contacting the tech hotline and getting a FSE out to look at the problem. This takes up to a week to happen. Meanwhile, the poor owner, who laid out $50,000 of his hard earned money, is left without an answer and without a truck. The dealer is not going to do much to ease the anxiety of the owner because the dealer is scared of a warranty reimbursement denial. Owner twists in the wind...this is the crux of the problem
...now let us see the exact same issue from the eyes of the GM customer. He, too, has shelled out his $50,000. His truck goes into the shop on the hook. The dealer runs the diagnostics and finds a destroyed HPFP. Does the dealer call GM and schedule an engineer's visit? Does the dealer call the customer and warn him that the repair is likely not covered under warranty? The answer to both those questions is a resounding NO. Instead, MR GM customer gets a phone call from the dealer telling him that the dealership has diagnosed the problem, ordered the parts and will call him when he can pick up his fully repaired truck. Oh by the way Mr. GM owner, these repairs were completely covered under warranty and there will be no charge for the loaner truck we gave you. Is there any wonder that the GM boards are virtually silent about a problem that , according to GM's own admissions to the NHTSA, is equal in size to the Ford problem?
It pains me to acknowledge this but GM has outflanked Ford badly in this issue. I have an email sent to me by the lead 6.7 designer from Ford telling me how bad he feels about the road Ford has taken in this issue. VW and Audi, among others, have also decided that the Bosch CP4 reliability issue is a large enough problem that they, like GM, just fix the vehicles under warranty. Ford's continuing anti customer position stands alone in this debate. Are the other manufacturers wrong? Common sense tells us no...
The 6.0 Ford debacle keeps coming up in these 6.7 discussions. Many that had the 6.0 Ford like to talk about how Ford stuck with them and warrantied their problems. Some even go as far as to brag about getting warranty repairs while running a performance tuner. Guy's, those days are over...and the 6.0 debacle is what ended them. Ford lost reputation and market share, not to mention a billion dollars in warranty costs, in that customer relations uproar. They know they got took by customers who abused the warranty system. They are making sure that does not happen with their in house designed baby. The problem is, they are taking it too far. Innocent and loyal customers have been hurt by the 6.7 HPFP warranty denials. This is what scares owners...especially if they do not have a spare $10,000 to fix their truck.
Regards
Is this from an authorized Ford dealer?
Keep in mind the ramifications present when a customer pay owner decides to not get the truck repaired by Ford. The truck had to be in a Ford facility for warranty consideration of the original HPFP failure. Guess what happens when this now very disappointed and angry owner removes the truck from the dealer to have it repaired elsewhere for less money? The now angry dealer files what is known as a "CuDL" report with the Tech Hotliine. He reports that the truck was removed from his shop without an authorized Ford dealership doing the repairs. He then loads that file with as much ****ing information as possible to further cloud the vehicle's warranty history. This shows up in any subsequent visits to a Ford dealer for other warranty work. Any subsequent HPF system repairs will not be covered because there has been unauthorized repair technicians working on the fuel system. These warranty woes will cascade down the problem possibility list to any parts that were removed or worked on during this unauthorized repair. Don't think it can happen to you...it can...and we are back to the crux of the problem.
Some may doubt my scenario. I must caution these fine people that I have BTDT. I pulled my truck from a crooked dealership. He filed the loaded CuDL report. My saving grace was I had the truck towed to a different Ford dealership. This dealership fought for over a month to get Ford to warranty the HPFP. In the end, they failed to win the argument. Politic's at Ford Headquaters won out and the truck was repaired under customer pay. My insurance company was left holding the cost. Because the truck was fixed at a Ford facility and according to Ford/Bosch procedures, I do not have to worry as much about future warranty denials for issues other than another HPFP debacle. If that happens...I am sure there will be another battle...
Too bad...I really do like the truck...
Regards
mmomega
AnyTimer
Just asking...
So your dealer won't let you purchase the exact same parts through somewhere else?
I guess my dealer is more mod friendly and not sure if being a high volume dealer helps because when my head gaskets needed to be replaced I could have the repair tech install ARP studs instead of the stock bolts. Everything else would be covered under warranty but actually installing the studs I would have to pay for, I'm wanting to say they quoted me around $150 or so, since I was on a time crunch on needing the truck back and out of town I just had them replace with stock bolts.
I'll give them a call tomorrow and see what they say since my extended warranty specifically states injector fuel pump, lines, fuel tank, etc. Even then, I won't know for sure until something happens.
So your dealer won't let you purchase the exact same parts through somewhere else?
I guess my dealer is more mod friendly and not sure if being a high volume dealer helps because when my head gaskets needed to be replaced I could have the repair tech install ARP studs instead of the stock bolts. Everything else would be covered under warranty but actually installing the studs I would have to pay for, I'm wanting to say they quoted me around $150 or so, since I was on a time crunch on needing the truck back and out of town I just had them replace with stock bolts.
I'll give them a call tomorrow and see what they say since my extended warranty specifically states injector fuel pump, lines, fuel tank, etc. Even then, I won't know for sure until something happens.
I know of no dealer that would allow a customer to purchase a Bosch CP4 HPFP from another source and then they would install it.. They are all in business to make a profit and parts are a huge profit center. I guess it is possible.
I will acknowledge that ARP studs for the 6.0 are an anomaly to that policy. There was such an uproar about supposed poor quality head bolts that dealers were inundated with the ARP stud requests. The arena for this type of repair was also wide open in the 6.0 days. Back in my 6.0 days, I called them the "throw parts and pray" days.
This brings us to the problem today. How many guy's know of a 6.0 owner that had head gaskets replaced under warranty on a truck with no symptoms of head gasket failure. I know of 3 personally, I am not one of them, that went to the dealer and complained about losing coolant. The "TPAP" policy allowed dealers to just fix these alleged failures under warranty. The forums were full of guy's admitting this ploy. It cost Ford millions. Today's 6.7 Ford has computing power and storage to keep track of all types of performance and service parameters. Dealer's have been told that Ford is watching the IDS downloads for warranty repairs for any anomalies in these parameters. Adding a tuner can not be disguised by simply returning to stock programming. Ford has scared the dealers to death about warranty reimbursement denials. Even the "big" dealers who used to overlook the modifications are now towing the warranty denial line. Too easy for Ford to see the "looking the other way" event.
Regards
I do not know about the Premium Care policy and warranty denial. Why would it make a difference in Ford's warranty decision. I would guess that if they started only taking care of the customers who bought this expensive policy it would come to the surface very quickly. A loud howl would be heard across the country from the standard warranty owners. Ford has enough bad publicity now...imagine the volume of that uproar...
Regards
mmomega
AnyTimer
I am merely gathering more information for those that may want to know. If an injector pump warranty was denied while under the extended warranty plan that specifically states may be nice to know. Some folks may be purchasing that warranty for the sole fact of an insurance policy for the fuel pump.
My premiumCARE 100,000 mile warranty was $2,000 even, so one may think $23/month for 84 months (unless you are a higher mileage driver) would be cheap considering the alternative. I purchased the same warranty on the '07 F350, the head gaskets went out after the standard warranty ran out.
I'm not Ford so I have no clue if it would or would not make a difference but I'm curious to know one way or the other.
My premiumCARE 100,000 mile warranty was $2,000 even, so one may think $23/month for 84 months (unless you are a higher mileage driver) would be cheap considering the alternative. I purchased the same warranty on the '07 F350, the head gaskets went out after the standard warranty ran out.
I'm not Ford so I have no clue if it would or would not make a difference but I'm curious to know one way or the other.
Mo
The Premium Care Extended Warranty lists what is covered beyond the standard warranty coverage. Standard warranty is 3/36,000 for some parts, 6/60,000 for some parts and 5/100,000 on the engine only. Emissions systems are automatically warrantied for 5/100,000. The extended warranty plan takes over after the expiration of the standard warranty. Let's use the HPFP for an example. It already carries the 5 year/100,000 mile engine warranty coverage. If it fails at 99,999 miles, in 4 years and 11.5 months, and warranty is considered, coverage will be under the original standard warranty. 2 more miles or 2 more weeks of ownership would throw the claim to the extended plan. Either way, the same criteria for warranty considerations would apply. Hopefully, by the time owners of the 6.7 with a Ford Premium Care Plan attain 100,001 miles or 60 months and a day of ownership, Ford will return to a customer satisfaction based company and fix the truck. If that has happened, even the standard warranty owners will have something for which to be thankful...I am not too confident on that happening.
Again, regarding your 6.0 head gaskets and extended warranty, this is an apples to oranges comparison. Ford never denied warranty coverage for any head gasket replacements. Heck, they replaced thousands of 6.0 head gaskets that had nothing wrong with them. The days of any type of 6.0 courtesy/loyalty warranty coverages are gone forever. Hoping that Ford will do this for the 6.7 HPFP's is not a plan...a better plan would be for all 6.7 owners to begin to pressure Ford to treat their owners like the other manufacturer's who use the Bosch CP4 treat their owners...just fix the truck under warranty while Bosch and Ford figure out how to make a pump that has specifications capable of survival using US standard fuel.
Regards
funntheson
Well-known member
What kind of insurance do you have for your truck that covers vehicle repairs?
This has been discussed before. Accidental contamination of the fuel supply is covered under the Comprehensive section of your auto insurance. The incident has to be presented correctly as an accidental mis-fueling such as DEF in the fuel tank, water or otherwise contaminated fuel from the retail seller or vandalism.
Ford was adamant that the HPFP in my truck was damaged by water contaminated fuel. The repair order and the declination of warranty statement clearly stated Ford' position. After reviewing the documents, my insurance approved the repair.
Regards
Shelby-GT-500
Member
I checked Tasca Parts. I think it was about 760.00. They are a ford dealer. Google them. Don't have my notes with me I'm on the road.
Thanks
Yep...the primary filter does a great job of stopping the aluminum debris from traveling up to the secondary filter. After my debacle, the primary filter had significant aluminum scarf embedded in the pleats. The secondary filter...not a flake...
A good friend of mine has an Open Road fiver. He frequents their forum. Details are emerging via an Open Road owner who works the Northern oil fields of Canada. He has had a HPFP failure. While he did get the pump repaired under warranty, it was another ugly battle with the bullies at Ford. It took a fearless selling dealer, dozens of phone calls and over 40 days without his truck before he finally got Ford to fix the truck.
Regards
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