Tri Glide Pin Box

hillsonwheels

Well-known member
Curious minds would like some input!

Took advantage of the Nashville rally offer by Lippert and had the Tri Glide installed. So far am pleased with it but would like it discussed by the Pros. Talked to a couple of folks at Mt. Airy (Bandstra and Yoacum) and they were going thru "usage pains " as well.

Consensus seemed to be that filling the donut to the top on the arrows was not necessarily the solution in all instances and maybe should be just a guide.

After pick up in Goshen where I started off as suggested, I had to add air to get back to desired level. Have had to add air one more time since. That seems to have settled down.

My major question/concern now is that the majority of the time while under tow at highway speeds the coach seems to be sitting on its haunches with the arrow tips showing. I now question whether I'm running level! Would that not be loading the rear wheels too much?

At slower speeds it settles down and seems to travel and inch +/- below the arrows head.

Comments please.

Dick
 

jnbhobe

Well-known member
:confused: I really don't know about going down the road Dick I can't see the arrows on mine. I agree with all the other stuff, I do about the same thing. I don't know how it can change the level,the pin weight makes the tri-glide part work. I"m not sure how the arrows would show other than the air pressure rising in the air bag while underway from the hitch going up and down. Will be interesting to see the comments.
 

Terry H

Past Texas North Chapter Leader/Moderator
Staff member
Dick,

I have noticed while towing with the TriGlide the following. When accelerating the the TriGlide raises up and I can see about 1/2 to 1 inch above the arrow. It will also raise with a heavy head wind. When slowing or braking the arrow will disappear. When driving at a steady speed it stays at the top of the arrow, except when going over bumps. Usually the trailer can be off level front to rear about 1 inch and not effect the weight difference between axles significantly.

If the air bag is inflated to the top of the arrow and the trailer is not at the correct front to rear level then there is 2 solutions. One, if possible lower the hitch in the truck or raise the TriGlide in the trailers king pin box. Or raise the trailer suspension. On my trailer I had to raise the trailer suspension 3 inches to correct a nose high issue and to eliminate a axle weight difference of 2,000 pounds.
 

Ray LeTourneau

Senior Member - Past Moderator
My Trail Air/Tri Glide is the opposite of Terry's. When acceleratin or going up hill, the shock compresses, when braking, decelerating or going downhill the shock extends or shows more of the arrow. The amount of air in the Tri Glide really shouldn't be used as a method or gage for the levelness of the trailer when hooked up and running down the road. As Terry mentioned, hitch height or pin box adjustment may be needed.

My Tri Glide doesn't remove all of the chucking but it's way better than before. Once I found the air leak at the fill fitting, I rarely need to adjust the amount of air in the bag. I can also tell you that 3 major factors affect the adjustment. Ambient air temperature, sun and elevation.
 

SouthernNights

Past South Carolina Chapter Leader
I knew after installing my Triglide I wasnt level. Made one short trip with it that way and was not comfortable at all thinking how much weight I was putting on the back axle of the trailer.
Dick I dont know if you noticed but after the rally on Sunday afternoon at Mt. Airy I dropped my hitch down one hole or about 1 1/2". That put me level again sitting still and put the shock about center of its travel with 62lbs in it. I did play with the air pressure on the way but ended up back at 62.

I put red tape at the top and bottom on the shock's tarvel and marked center. I watch it going down the highway. Like Ray, depending on acceleration or braking the the bag will compress or expand but I do know where level is now sitting still and with that marked on the shock it appears the trailer may be level most of the time-on good smooth roads.
 

hoefler

Well-known member
The arrow is used to get the proper ride height on the air bag, not to level the trailer. If there is too much air in the bag, the bag tops out and you will have the shock banging as it limits the upper travel of the air bag. If it is too low on air pressure, the bag will bottom out and cause bag failure. You will have a different type of bucking in both instances, both not good. When properly aired up, it will float as you go down the road. The height needs to be adjusted as your load changes, water load, holding tanks empty or not, your supplies and other goodies for your stay. You should not rely on an air pressure as a set point. Use the arrow for your correct height. As far as over loading one axle or the other, unless you have a rubber ride or torsion axles, you will all ways have equal load front to rear as long as the springs are not bottomed out. That is why they call the thing in the middle that connects the springs together a " Equalizer ". In a 35'-40' rig, a 1"-2" out of level front to rear will equate to only about a 1/2" difference between axles, not enough to worry about.
 

cookie

Administrator
Staff member
Yep Dick, I concur with my colleagues. Acceleration and slowing down will cause movement. And like Larry I dropped my hitch one set of holes. The Tri Glide jaw adds about 1.50 inches of height so if you were level before installation that is something you should do.
Also like Ray, I had a leak at the fitting.....on both of my Trail Airs. So if you have to add air, use a little liquid soap and check for a leak.

Peace
Dave
 

Nabo

Southeast Region Director-Retired
Dick - when we installed our Tri-Glide, it raised the nose of the BC up bigtime so we had to lower the hitch to the bottom holes. Now with about 60 lbs of pressure, the BC is level and seems to travel level also. The concern with the lower hitch is in a tight turning radius and the kingpin hitting the bedrails but so far haven't had a major issue. As for it holding air between trips - nope, have to re-air it everytime. I had a concern that maybe it had a leak but can't find one. Just seems that when it sits for a couple of weeks, the air just seeps out. Glad I take a same air tank with us.
 

Ray LeTourneau

Senior Member - Past Moderator
Dick - when we installed our Tri-Glide, it raised the nose of the BC up bigtime so we had to lower the hitch to the bottom holes. Now with about 60 lbs of pressure, the BC is level and seems to travel level also. The concern with the lower hitch is in a tight turning radius and the kingpin hitting the bedrails but so far haven't had a major issue. As for it holding air between trips - nope, have to re-air it everytime. I had a concern that maybe it had a leak but can't find one. Just seems that when it sits for a couple of weeks, the air just seeps out. Glad I take a same air tank with us.
Nathan, try removing the fill fitting, clean all of the gook and any other sealant they may have used. Put two full wraps of Teflon tape on the threads and tighten it up but don't over do it. You might also try replacing the valve core. At least remove it, dab a little 303 on the rubber part and put it back in. These steps should eliminate your slight leak. Hopefully anyway...
 

bill40

Well-known member
I guess I was lucky with mine it was level from day one but they sent the wrong size air bag for my unit. Once the new bag was installed I played with the psi. After a couple tries it worked out. Follow Rays advice and it should fix the air leak. For my setup it was a very big improvement in ride and yes I can see the movement of the arrow.
 

hillsonwheels

Well-known member
Well I started this and I've read what has been said by the "pros" so far. So, I'll jump in with another thought (if I could ever be accused of having one?) or two.

At the time of install, considering the measurements suggested for proper stance of coach, the Trail Air triglide was installed at the uppermost holes on the pin box mounting on the coach. I am out of adjustment up and down. Ron Mc Coy, who installed the level up system, was nice enuff to assist me withe lowering my hitch to its lowest setting on my hitch. (It is a Curt 20K slider.) So far, clearance wise, (and I've really watched it in uneven terrain) all is well.

Early on, for all the stated reasons, Ididn't think air pressure should be a key to use. And, I like what was said about the equaflex and equalizing the load. So, I guess I really don't have to worry about loading up the rear "tars" but I'm still curious about the silly thing showing air above the arrow tips when undertow.

Should I be starting out by filling only to the bottom of the arrow tip? I know a lot of what we do falls into the "common sense" area.

Further comments are appreciated. As has been said, inquiring minds need to know these things!

Dick
 

porthole

Retired
Dick - no matter what I set the pressure to when I start out I always end up making 1 or 2 adjustments during the trip. I pretty much try and get it set to where most of the time it as at the arrow tip..

As you have found, where you are accelerating or decelling it is never "right on the money".

If I was going to keep mine I would connect the air supply to my wireless controller I am using fo rmy air bags. with the controller you set a pressure and then the unit maintains that pressure, e.g. unloading the weight it dumps air, loading it cycles the compressor etc.
 

jbeletti

Well-known member
Dick,

Please consider giving good ol' boy, Dale Fenton a call at Trailair for your own satisfaction and the enlightenment of all of us following this thread. He is the inventor and he is accessible. Try this number: (800) 998-4238. Circle back here to post Mr. Fenton's wisdom.

In the mean time, here are the FAQs from the Trailair website:

Air Pin

FAQ / Things To Know

Q. Do I need an air compressor? How do I fill it with air?
A.
An air compressor is not required but is certainly a recommended item to have if you are going to use an air ride product. If your truck does not already have air onboard, most any portable air compressor designed to fill a truck tire will work great as long as it can produce air pressure from 80psi to 120psi depending on the hitch needed and the coach you're pulling. A standard tire fill valve is used on the topside of the air spring to fill it with air so it is just like filling a tire.

Q. How much air does it take?
A. A combination of things affect the amount of air needed such as; the size of the air spring in diameter and height, the pin weight of the coach, the mechanics of the individual hitch, altitude and ambient temperature. Air pressures can range from 20 psi to 120 psi depending on the aforementioned items. The air ride pin box is to be maintained at a predetermined ride height found on the system. We want you to maintain the ride height, not the air pressure. With the truck and trailer coupled, at rest and on level ground, you should have enough air in the bag to open the jaw to a point that the bottom lip of the top shroud on the shock absorber is even with the arrows on the decal that is affixed to the lower body of the shock absorber.

Q. How much does the hitch move up and down in tow?
A. The unique scissor action of the air ride pin box is designed to travel up 1" and down 1" at the king pin for 2" of total travel. At the front of the pin box, the travel is about 1 ½" up and down for a total of 3" travel.

Q. What happens if air bag loses air?
A. If the system loses air, troubleshooting is easy because it can be only one of three things; the air spring fitting, the fill valve or the air spring itself. First thing to check is the seal of the air spring fitting to make sure it is sealed by simply pouring water on the area. If it bubbles, pull the fitting out, re-coat it with Teflon tape or standard pipe fitters dope and re-install (torque it to 20 ft./lbs). Next item to check is the fill valve by spraying soapy water on the area with the cap removed. If it bubbles, replace the fill valve core by simply sticking the topside of the cap onto the valve core and spinning counter clockwise to remove it. It can be found at most auto parts stores or by contacting Trailair. If the first two are not leaking then the air spring is not holding air and a replacement should be obtained directly from Trailair.

Q. Can I pull my fifth wheel coach without air in the air spring?
A. Absolutely!! Every Trailair air ride pin box design comes equipped with mechanical stops that insure the air spring, shock absorber or other components will be properly maintained in the event of an air failure. In the event the coach is pulled without any air, the ride quality will revert to the quality you had with the standard pin box that you replaced.

Q. How much will it extend my pin?
A. That depends on the pin box being replaced. Many of the advertisements and articles show our extended pin box because it was the first air ride pin box we unveiled. If you match your replacement style to a Trailair pin box, the pin would not extend more than about 5 inches and in many cases, it will be the same.

Q. Is the air spring and shock absorber an off the shelf item?
A. Either Goodyear or Firestone makes the air springs and are standard air springs found in most of their industrial catalogs. Either Monroe or Sachs Automotive Co makes the shock absorbers for Trailair. Both companies use standard shock components but both have special internal valving suited specifically for the needs of Trailair. Suitable replacements may be obtained through authorized Trailair dealers or directly from Trailair.

Q. How do I hook and unhook from my truck?
A. When hooking and unhooking, the main thing to keep in mind is to not over compensate for the oscillation of the lower jaw. You should hook and unhook without changing the air in the air spring. When unhooking from the trailer you can avoid "high pinning" by raising your coach just enough to take most of the weight off of the truck (even though the lower jaw is pushing down, you can take most of the weight off the truck). A good indicator of when the weight is off the truck is when the king pin plate on the lower jaw of the Trailair air ride pin box is parallel to the ground. At that point, then unlock the fifth wheel hitch and pull out. Sometimes you have to "pop" the jaws of your fifth wheel loose if they are in a bind by putting your truck in forward or reverse and stepping on the brake just enough to dislodge the jaw mechanism in your fifth wheel hitch. Be careful to not damage your landing gear on your coach.

When you reconnect the truck to the fifth wheel, the lower jaw will be down approximately 1 1/2" in the front. The Trailair lower jaw is built with a front lip that will allow your fifth wheel to push against it as you back the truck under the trailer. Simply line up the pin and back under the trailer, the truck will push the lower jaw out of the way and the king pin will snap into the fifth wheel. Be sure to lock your fifth wheel and attach your safety brake cable as well as connect your electrical cable before you travel.

Q. Can I use my tri-pod with this air ride pin box?
A. Yes. You may find, depending on the construction of your tri-pod, that you will have to raise your coach about 1 ½" after you have disconnected from the truck so that the tri-pod will slip under the kingpin. Once the tri-pod is in place, simply lower the coach down onto the tri-pod, thus transferring the weight to it. To remove the tri-pod, lift the coach up high enough to remove it. Remember to let the king pin back down that 1 ½" for reconnecting to the truck so that you do not "high pin" when connecting to the fifth wheel hitch.

Q. Which will benefit most, the truck or the trailer?
A. In most cases, the largest benefit will be seen or felt by the fifth wheel coach. The ability of the Trailair air ride pin box to absorb road shock and stresses from the truck and trailer battling each other is unsurpassed. The dampening effect will reduce trailer frame flex, stress to the outer skin and also to the interior amenities. In most cases, a dramatic benefit in ride quality is felt in the truck as well. In a small percentage of cases, little or no benefit is felt in the truck. If that happens to be the case, many times Trailair can make the performance better with different air bags or shock absorbers. Simply call a Trailair technician for assistance if you're having this experience.

Q. Does the size of the truck effect the performance?
A. It can. An undersized truck suspension or underpowered truck can have an adverse effect on the ride quality when pulling a fifth wheel coach. Always make sure you are operating within the recommended practices of the manufacturer of both the tow vehicle and the Fifth wheel coach.

Q. Does tire inflation have an effect?
A. Absolutely!! First, an under inflated tire is dangerous and anyone towing should make sure that all tires meet the requirements for load and inflation as set forth by the tire manufacturer used on both the truck and the trailer. Having said that, Trailair highly recommends using a tire inflation chart that can be obtained from most tire manufactures or from the Tire and Rim Association, Inc. It is clear that an OVER-inflated tire can adversely affect the ride quality of a rig, sometimes dramatically. For example, a common tire used in light truck is the 235/85R/16 load range E tire. Most makes of tires allow for a single tire to be loaded to 3042 pounds at 80psi. Many manufactures of this size tire allow for it also to be at less air pressure when seeing less weight. In the case of this tire if the load bourn by the tire is 2400 pounds, it may be acceptable to run it at 60psi. By simply knowing the weights of all axles, both loaded and empty, and using recommended practices, your tires can be operated within safe ranges that will allow you to carry the load properly and safely, but also enjoy the softest ride possible. Also be sure that you have the correct air pressure for the weight when connected to your trailer. Consult your tire manufacturer or dealer for Light Truck Load & Inflation tables from the Tire and Rim Association, Inc for the make and model tire.

Q. Will the air ride pin box work with various rear trailer suspensions?
A. Yes. The simple rule is that the better quality the rear suspension, the less affect the air ride pin box will have on overall ride quality. However, the important thing to keep in mind is that even with the very best possible rear suspension (Of course we are partial to the Trailair RV-Series rear air ride suspension), the battle between the truck and the coach still remains and the air ride pin box will certainly reduce the effects of that battle.
 

hillsonwheels

Well-known member
Jim,

Thanks for the input. Will call Dale Fenton as soon as I can.

Me thinks some of the folks "disunnerstood" what I said. I know that the arrow tips would/could be visible when accelerating. What I alluded to is more or less constant visibility of arrow tips or space above at constant speed on the highway.

Dale, I'm sure, will have an answer for me. Once I talk to him, I will follow up here.

Again, thanks to all who have responded or who might have something else to add.

Dick
 

Boca_Shuffles

Well-known member
When we had ours installed in Goshen, Ron mentioned that the arrow sticker might not always be installed correctly at the factory. His suggestion is to adjust the air so that the hitch is parallel to the truck's side rails when the truck and trailer is on a level surface. This is will correct the leveling problem that occurs if the adhesive label is not installed in the correct position.
 
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